Tags
Davide Piffer looked at 2,404 genomic variants found to predict education (a rough proxy for IQ) and used these to create polygenic scores of eight ethnic groups reared in First World conditions. He then compared the polygenic scores with the mean IQ of each group and found a 0.979 correlation.
Educational Attainment and Intelligence Inferred
from Gwas Hits: A Replication of Previous Findings
Using Recent Data by Davide Piffer, 2019
The line of best fit allows us to predict the mean IQ of any group from their PGS (GWAS sig.):
Mean IQ = 9.31(PGS (GWAS sig.)) – 358
Given the 0.979 correlation, genotype predicts IQ remarkably well: Finnish 102, Ashkenazi 108, Southern Europe 99, Estonia 100, NW European 100, African American 83, Latino 95, East Asians 105.
So while our genomic predictions of IQ remain poor at the individual level, Piffer is showing we can predict the mean IQs of ethnic groups with incredible precision, at least when they’re all reared in similar countries.
Because we have only found a tiny fraction of the genetic variants associated with IQ (or its proxy education), the margin of error for predicting any one person’s IQ remains high. But when you try to predict the average IQ of an entire ethnic group, the overestimates and underestimates cancel each other out, and there’s a near perfect correlation between the mean polygenic score and the mean IQ.
Pumpkin Person 
If the data is accurate, it implies that different races within a given developing country live in similar environments—or that the environmental differences don’t really matter.
i remember professor shoe challenging the “lower mean but higher variance” theory of euro vs china people IQ using PISA scores.
the problem with this is the numbers don’t matter because everyone KNOWS the truth from personal experience.
the very smartest people are all 100% NOT china people.
No the most creative people are 100% not Northeast Asian, but the very smartest people are 100% Northeast Asian. You’re too dumb to tell the difference.
no. it’s true. at least for VIQ, or what people mean when they say “smart”.
hence the dearth of china people in high VIQ professions.
but i’d also say that the highest VIQs are also not jews.
all of the geniuses i’ve known were male gentiles of nw european ancestry.
VIQ is not what people mean by smart, it’s just that high V people can hide their spatial & mathematical stupidity if they work in a verbal profession
Lol
Is this an established dependence relation between genotype and IQ score?
of course not. piffer made up his scores to maximize the correlation. why did he stop at .99 or whatever. he could’ve made it 1.00000…
Possibly. There are so many SNPs to choose from that he could have cherrypicked to get whatever results he wanted. But I doubt it. No one works that hard just to produce pseudoscience
Piffer writes:
Among the 2416 GWAS significant SNPs (Lee et al., 2018) [7] 2404 SNPs were found in the
gnomAD dataset. The polygenic scores are reported in Table 5. Since this is a novel dataset,
population IQ estimates were generated according to the latest evidence. The correlation between
PGS (GWAS sig.) and population IQ is r = 0.979 (N = 8).
so he claims to have used all the significant SNPs from Lee et al, 2018, that he found in the gnomAD dataset. So at least the method of picking SNPs is at least self-reportedly objective.
That’d look more suspicious than an almost-perfect-but-not-quite number.
“No one works that hard just to promote pseudoscience.”
Haha what?
Here’s something I just read that made me think of you RR:
I would like to pause and note just how annoying the “but you haven’t proven causation!” crowd is:
Imagine if I said that I thought the blood circulates through the body in a loop instead of being generated anew by the heart with every pump, and someone protested that blood couldn’t possibly circulate because I hadn’t shown any way for blood to get from the arteries to the veins and back to the heart.
This was a real debate in physiology. That the heart pumps is obvious. That veins and arteries carry blood is also obvious. That people die if you cut them open and let the blood drain out, though, mystified doctors for centuries.
Capillaries, unfortunately for many patients, are too small to see with the naked eye. Without any mechanism to return blood from the arteries to the heart, doctors refused to believe that it did. They instead believed that blood was produced anew with every heartbeat and was consumed at our extremities. Bleeding patients, therefore, shouldn’t cause any great difficulties.
The fact that we could not see capillaries before the invention of the microscope should not have caused doctors to reject the theory of circulation, only to say that a mechanism had not yet been found to make it work. The circulation hypothesis did a better job of explaining various facts of human anatomy–like the existence of veins carrying blood to the heart and the habit of patients to die after bleeding–than the heart-generation hypothesis.
The insistence on clinging to the older theory due to the lack of a capillary mechanism lead, of course, to the deaths of thousands of patients. (For more on the history of medicine, anatomy, and circulation, I recommend William Bynum’s A Little History of Science.)
How something works is vastly secondary to the question of whether it works at all in the first place. If it works, it works. If you can’t figure out how, you admit that you don’t know and hope that someday it’ll be clear. What you don’t do is claim that a thing cannot be true or cannot actually work simply because you don’t understand how it happens.
I don’t understand how airplanes stay in the sky, but that doesn’t make them fall down. Reality doesn’t stop just because we don’t understand it; to think that it does is pure, asinine hubris.
https://evolutionistx.wordpress.com/2020/01/18/whither-hbd-happy-1000-posts/
“What you don’t do is claim that a thing cannot be true or cannot actually work simply because you don’t understand how it happens.”
This was in reference to “Evolutionary” psychology so:
(1) Name an EP hypothesis;
(2) State a prediction from the hypothesis; and
(3) Explain how the prediction follows from the hypothesis.
Subrena Smith’s recent article on EP also, of course, states that EP as currently formulated is not possible.
no dumbass. the effect size of the SNPs can be set to make the correlation perfect.
which is why I said “at least the method of picking SNPs is at least self-reportedly objective”. Good lord your reading comprehension sucks.
Not only can you not read, but your judgement is not great, because you assume Piffer set the SNPs, but in fact the polygenic scores were made by Lee (2018) who has nothing to with Piffer’s work.
east asian countries are not similar to western euopean countries.
east asians in western european countries are selected. the chinese of spain are selected for stupidity, but in general immigrants are smarter than their former countrymen.
In their home countries they have higher genomic scores than whites in any country.
Is there any way of differentiating verbal and non-verbal scores on the polygenic level so far?
I don’t think there is. But what’s striking is that both Asians & Ashkenazim do so well despite having opposite verbal vs spatial profiles. This shows the method is not biased to one or the other.
Well yes, the method indicates/correlates to overall IQ, which is why I was wondering if there was a specific technique/algorithm to differentiate the components, but apparently such a method doesn’t exist yet, so we will only be able to know about overall IQ estimations from genes.
Pumpkin, is it proven that higher SES Hispanics speak mostly English?
Pumpkin, is it confirmed that most high SES Hispanics speak English instead of Spanish? Also, since the actual vocab size of bilingual regardless of SES is lower, wouldn’t that guarantee that verbal ability is underestimated in bilingual populations regardless of the PIQ VIQ discrepancy, hence, the 0 point discrepancy in Hispanics only shows that at this level viq would be higher than the PIQ if they were English speakers?
Wheres all my comments?
In the trash where they belong
this is why lesbianism.
https://v637g.app.goo.gl/ZQXyHFyUwYFGiEvd8
How is it an Oprah meme? Oprah constantly says being a mom is the most important job on earth & that mothers are the true spiritual teachers.
The lack of any Mexican lives matter group, Mexican-only churches or a whole host of them calling white people racist led me to believe it would be possible to assimilate with them without suffering from too many detrimental effects. They seem to be more adamant on melding in with white people and emulating them in appearance and action. I suspected they had average IQ’s closer to white people because of this. If their IQ was lower I think they would separate themselves from white people more.
From my time living in Texas I’ve seen a lot of white managers and owners hire Mexicans and they seem to like them. I’ve also noticed Mexicans don’t have as much of an in-group bias as black people or asian people. They seldom associate with one another just because they’re Mexican.
I once heard a quote from some genetic researcher who said, “There’s really only two races, there’s Africans and then there’s everyone else”.
Although, I still think we should build a border wall because a lot of Mexicans coming from Mexico are ciminals or smuggling drugs.
Very interesting. It’s different in LA. More ethnocentrism/underclass behavior, but not like blacks.
I think there’re a couple of reasons why. 1) Mexicans in Texas are more enterprising b/c they don’t want to live in the ghetto. 2) Conservative Texas culture keeps it in check.
Oh, and lower cost of living keeps you out of the ghetto.
I completely agree. Mexicans in California still speak mostly Spanish while in Texas most speak English.
Don’t be fooled, Mexicans have the greatest in-group bias. It’s just hard to tell since they’re very extroverted and culturally-fluid people. Overall, they’re the most xenophoboic race out there.
@Pumpkinperson
This is mostly unrelated to the OP, but I was wondering how you derived the mass at the young age over here: https://pumpkinperson.com/2016/05/24/how-much-of-the-black-white-iq-gap-can-be-explained-by-brain-size/
If the mean age if 60, then the mass at age 60 should be 90.25% of the mass at age 40.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2596698/
Mass at age 40 is pretty much the adult brain mass so to get the mean adult brain mass, I simply divided the ‘brain weight height adjusted’ numbers by 0.9025. I get the mean adult brain mass of white males at 1542 grams, black males at 1429 grams, white females at 1387 grams and black females at 1283 grams. These numbers seem to be different from yours, so where have I erred?
Furthermore, where did you find the ratio of brain mass vs cranial capacity. You said ” Then, converting brain weight to brain volume is simply a matter of multiplying by 1.036.” May I know about the source for the 1.036 value for future reference?
See the top paragraph of page 11 of this source to understand why I multiplied by 1.036:
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.489.6530&rep=rep1&type=pdf
Thanks.
Mass at age 40 is pretty much the adult brain mass so to get the mean adult brain mass, I simply divided the ‘brain weight height adjusted’ numbers by 0.9025. I get the mean adult brain mass of white males at 1542 grams, black males at 1429 grams, white females at 1387 grams and black females at 1283 grams. These numbers seem to be different from yours, so where have I erred?
My source estimated brain weight at age 25 (not age 40) by looking at age trends within each demographic group in their sample, and because of sampling error and possible racial and sex differences in rate of decline, the rate of decline they calculated may not perfectly match the rate of decline your source found.
okay
Been trying out some of Luke Ford’s Alexander Technique exercises. Feeling a lot more mellow the last 3 days from doing it: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLhQp0uq1786KWbqtfjNTrW0TRezP7K_gg
Pumpkin, what is a 120 IQ student like in a modern day high school? What classes would they be taking, how well would they do in them, how hard they work?