An interesting quote I discovered about the old math SAT:
Although the normative reports for the PSAT and the SAT do not indicate the number of boys and girls earning the highest scores on these tests, Dorans and Livingston (1987) reported the number of very high scores earned by boys and girls on the SAT-Mathematics for all English-speaking examinees tested in June 1981 and May 1982. When the examinees from the two test administrations were combined, 96% of 99 scores of 800 (the highest possible scaled score), 90% of 433 scores in the 780-790 range, 81% of 1479 scores between 750 and 770, and 56% of 3,768 scores of 600 were earned by boys.
Thus, the degree of male overrepresentation was directly related to the level of SAT-Math performance. However, the population of adolescents was not examined. Different percentages might be found for the subset of high-ability youths who did not take the SAT. But given the high correlation found between ability and SAT completion, it is doubtful that there were enough unrepresented youths to bias the reported percentages.
Source: Feingold, A. (1988). Cognitive gender differences are disappearing. American Psychologist, 43(2), 95-103
If 96% of 800 math SAT people were male, it’s interesting to ask what an 800 math SAT score equated to on the IQ scale in the 1980s. The New York Times states:
Out of about 1.5 million students who took the S.A.T. in 1982-83, 749 got a perfect score on the math section, according to the Educational Testing Service.
According to Ron Hoeflin, during the 1980s, roughly one third of American 18-year-olds had taken the SAT and virtually all of the top talent had, so a perfect math score was not just the 749 best out of the 1.5 million who took the test, but the best out of all 4.5 million in that age group, and thus equates to the one in 6000 level, or math IQ 154+ (U.S. norms)
Although I think the math SAT measures only one kind of math IQ. Women are perhaps better at more intuitive math like statistics.
What about verbal? What percent of the 800 verbals are female/male?
I read the same about the Vanderbilt and Duke sélection programs at 1% and 0.01%.
At that level, 155 IQ in math, there were 50 boys for one girl (98%) only before the asian came. Over the time, it went down to 12 boys of 1 girl , with 75% of the girls being asian.
I don’t remember from the figure if it was only an effect of higher asian mean or if, on top of that, asian women were a bit closer to asian men than white women are to white men. The thing is that 4% of the population took 75% of the spots for asian women versus around 50% for men in the 0.01% math section.
In verbal, you didn’t find those Asians. And you got 50% of women … even at 0.01%. Another problem is that the test may select in part on maturity, and possibility you wouldn’t have the same people 7 years later with a test able to discriminate at that level (like old verbal Sat).
Mikey Blayze said:
So Pumpkin i’m looking at South Korea 2018 and the country has the lowest birth rate in the world. Average woman has 0.8 kids. That is absolutely ridiculous. Very quickly their population will go extinct at this rate. (note that there has only ever been 1 country that has risen its population to replacement levels after dipping below avg woman 2 kids and it was temporary in war time.Women were willing to produce 8 children on avg in the hopes of more sons for the war .After the war the birth rate declined right back to below replacement. No Tax breaks or government incentives can convince women to make more babies.For example France tried tax breaks and 3rd child incentives and it made 0 impact. Low world birth rate is the main reason for the current wave of mass immigration to the EU.)
Anyway my point is that South Korea 2018 is the #2 ranked country in terms of IQ at 106. South Korea is the template for what all world civilizations will become, based on the world birth rates dropping like Enron’s stock all over the world.
Do you think that IQ 106 women are reproducing with IQ 106 men?
Or do you think maybe it is a more uneven distribution IQ 100 women
IQ 110 men?
I am curious because this leads into the question are people becoming more intelligent, now that the pressure has turned on so to speak for reproduction.
When societies industrialize IQ skyrockets AND birth rates plummet As society moves forward are “jocks” becoming more intelligent or are “nerds” becoming more dominant and aggressive.?
My personal thoughts are that in this day in age (at least in South Korea,Japan etc.)
only the most overall intelligent, successful,attractive men can even produce a single child?
I would actually like to get everyone’s thoughts on this 1 simple question. Are we evolving into an overall higher quality form of human? to me the data says yes.
Thinking Mouse said:
South Korea has 1,1 children per family.
Romania is the only example of an country rising above replacement levels. Romania is the only one who did it with policy. Iran already had high fertility rates before the war.
During the 18th-19th century upper class educated people had more children, around 35% more children than lower class people. But today they have 9% less children. Though education and class might have not been as selective of genotypic it as it was in the past than today.
Educated women have more kids than educated men. So its 110 IQ females and 100 iq men that breed. I recall African American women have an very very steep negative correlation between education and fertility compared to other groups, but maybe I’m wrong on that since i dont remember the source. I also recall the dysgenic trend being strongest in the third world, where the largest share of population growth occurs. I’m not sure if china fits in with that “third world trend”.
So i argue we see an very slow trend towards getting more prole in all countries, and maybe also prole populations get even proler.
Thinking Mouse said:
an open thread this early?
PP is it true that some Subtests are differently G-loaded for different populations?
Mikey Blayze said:
hmmm back in the day there would have been about a hundred comments by now.
Well a lot of people have been banned
Is philosopher banned ? It would be hurting livelihood of the blog a lot. Even more than Afro.
I understand that you want the comments be clean, but I am not sure the content of the comment as any influence on future readers or censors. It’s more the quality of the posting and the number of comments that matter. Robert site had very restrained commenters and he went down because of the owner posts .
The policy about videos without comments is perfectly sound to clean comments section.
Mikey Blayze said:
I think Pumpkin ended up banning his biggest fans. I mean those guys Phil, afro Illuminati cat, mugabe,myself, etc. Those guys really made the blog interesting. We would have 400 plus comments every post in less than 24 hours. Those were great times. A lot of knowledge was being shared.
I did not ban illumanati cat.
We are betas, omegas etc missing our alphas …
Winfrey Jr. Mama! [I love Puppybook/ this comment Puppylove will accept] said:
”I think Pumpkin ended up banning his biggest fans. I mean those guys Phil, afro Illuminati cat, mugabe,myself, etc. Those guys really made the blog interesting. We would have 400 plus comments every post in less than 24 hours. Those were great times. A lot of knowledge was being shared.”
look like psychosis
lol bruno you and mikey blaze are not even male.
Thinking Mouse said:
PP please awnser my question
Pumpkin Person, may I ask for some advice for a career based on my IQ score and subtests
Working Memory Index: 126 or 118 (I kind of practiced Digit Span with numbers, tried it on letters, it transferred- Also, a lot of articles have implied that if you train digit span without mnemonics, it actually improves your memory)
Digit Span- 12 or 15
Processing Speed Index- 116 or 118
Symbol Search- 13
Verbal IQ- 118
Performance IQ- 99
Matrix Reasoning- 13
Block Design- 9
Visual Puzzles- 7
Pumpkin Person, how do you decide which comments you respond to?
It’s kind of random. Depends how busy i am at the time & if the question can be quickly answered
Avoid jobs requiring spatial ability (i.e. mechanic, pilot, driver, engineer)
I have another question, will my 12 scaled score in similarities inhibit my logic? Or, will it be compensated by the other parts of verbal iq?
PP, would my scores indicate some sort of learning disability? It’s a 19 point difference. I’m decent at math, got 90th-98th percentile on the PSATs I’ve taken.
Due to my doubts about my scores, there’s a chance of my score being lowered to around 114, which is kind of lowering my self-concept, for the fact that it’s not above average. Of course, there’s no difference between 114 and 116, with a 114 I can do whatever the hell I want (I’ve also been described as pretty creative). Is a 114 IQ still a “smart range” IQ?
Accountant. CFA. Auditor.
Why am I banned?
for your own good.
Why no correlation reduction?
What do you mean?
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Monsieur le Baron said:
That’s a lot of 800s. Given how often people talk about how hard the pre-94 test was, I was expecting far less perfect scores.
I’ll have to make a mental note about how full a shit a person is whenever they bring up the test’s legendary difficulty.
Apparent only one in a million U.S. 17-year-olds were capable of scoring 800 on both the verbal & the math
Monsieur le Baron said:
Fascinating. This reminds me of something I read on Steve Sailer where professional baseball players were the best players of their original teams, but their specialties/talents became apparent in the Majors. I guess that would mean the pre-94 test was hard enough that 800s were the realm of specialists, while post-94, the new 800 was easy enough that it was dominated by generalists, so the categories of perfect 800 on math/verbal and perfect 1600 had significant overlap.
This matches my personal experience with the GRE, which, while only marginally harder, was hard enough to bring out a mismatch between my math and verbal skills.
If a new Ravens Matrices Test was constructed in 2019, would the norms be the same (like, answering 48 questions right would be average), just that the actual questions would be harder to account for the Flynn effect.
No, not necessarily.
Pumpkin, how easy would it be to develop mental numerical reasoning skills for simple operations such as division and multiplication over an expanded period of time?
Probably not that hard. As LOTB noted, Jaime Escalante was able to teach kids at a low IQ high school to do calculus perhaps by memorizing certain algorithms. But if you lack IQ you’ll eventually hit a wall where the algorithms don’t work.
Oh, I must say, without instruction, how hard is it to develop numerical reasoning skills for division and multiplication.