Ann Coulter is one of the many people I promised to estimate the IQ of in the near-future, which got me thinking about a recent comment she made:
Trump graduated from the Wharton School of Business and went on to make $11 billion. Carson went from Yale to the University of Michigan Medical School and was the first man to separate twins conjoined at the brain. Fiorina graduated from Stanford University and then earned $80 million in business.
By contrast, look up the educational achievement of the average pundit sneering at Trump’s idiocy and the ordinariness of his supporters. I won’t be as nasty as they are, but wow! – people who went to bush-league schools shouldn’t throw stones. There’s nothing wrong with attending a bush-league college. But maybe ease up on holding yourself out as a great intellectual appalled by the dirty masses if you went to a third-rate college in the era of need-blind admissions.
Actually authoritative Forbes magazine puts Trump’s net worth at $4.5 billion, which is unbelievably impressive, but it’s nowhere near $11 billion. But Coulter’s larger point is that where you went to college is a good proxy for intelligence. Trump himself seems to share this view. I remember an episode of The Apprentice where a contestant was bragging about college credentials, and Trump’s sidekick George H. Ross noted that where you went to college didn’t matter. But Trump rather obnoxiously cut Ross off saying something like “I disagree. It means a lot. It’s very very important” I wonder what Trump’s 80% non-college base would think of that.
In order to test Coulter’s assertion, I looked at some SAT stats for a few colleges:
| college | sat range (25 percentile to 75 percentile) CR + M | iq equivalent | estimated standard deviation |
| caltech | 1450-1580 | 141-152 | 8.25 |
| harvard | 1400-1590 | 137-153 | 12 |
| harvey mudd | 1390-1570 | 136-151 | 11.25 |
| yale | 1380-1550 | 136-149 | 9.75 |
| stanford | 1360-1550 | 134-149 | 11.25 |
| princeton | 1360-1540 | 134-149 | 11.25 |
| georgia tech | 1220-1415 | 123-138 | 11.25 |
SATs were converted to IQ equivalents using my formula: IQ equivalent = 23.835 + 0.081(post-1995 SAT score: CR + M). Standard deviations (SD) were estimated for each college by multiplying the IQ equivalent gap between the 75th and 25th percentile by 0.75. This was done because assuming a roughly normal curve in each college, the SD should be 3/4 as large as the gap between these two percentiles. For example, the IQs of all Americans are normally distributed with an SD of 15, which is 3/4 of the 20 point gap between the 25th percentile (IQ 90) and the 75th percentile (IQ 110).
Analysis of variance
The average SD of the seven colleges above is 10.71. Squaring 10.71 to get the variance gives 114.7. But if we square the SD for Americans as a whole (15) we get 225. This suggests 51% (114.7/225) of the variance in IQ (as measured by SAT) exists within a given college, which means that 49% (0.49) of the variance in U.S. IQ must exist between colleges (and non-college). The square root of 0.49 suggests a potent 0.7 correlation between where you went to college (assuming you did) and how well you did on the SAT (or for those who didn’t take it, how well you would have done).
In order to test whether the correlation really is 0.7, it helps to look at two extremes. The most selective and least selective colleges in America.
The most selective college in America
In terms of median SAT scores, Caltech is the most selective college in America. There are about 224 freshman a year (excluding foreign students) out of 4.413 million 18-year-olds in America. Cutting the number of freshman in half, we see the median freshman is in the top 112 out of 4,413 million, or roughly the top one in 39,402 in terms of selectivity of college attended. Thus, if there were a perfect correlation between IQ and college attended, the median Caltechie would have an IQ of 161 (U.S. norms). Their actual median SAT (CR + M) is 1515 to 1525 (depending on the source) which equates to an IQ of 147, and we should probably reduce this by 5 points to 142 because I suspect many students inflated their scores by taking the SAT multiple times to get the best combination of scores (a procedure known as superscoring and it is by no means unique to Caltech)
The least selective colleges in America
The least selective colleges in America are no college at all or colleges that don’t require the SAT. 65% of all American late teens do not take the SAT, so the median non-SAT taker is in the bottom 33% of American late teens in college attended (or not attended). Thus if there were a perfect correlation between IQ and college attended, non-SAT takers would have a mean IQ of 93 (U.S. norms).
What is the actual IQ of non-SAT takers? We know that the average SAT score of the 2/3rd of U.S. late teens who take the SAT is about 1016 (IQ 106), and we know the average IQ of all U.S. teens is 100 (by definition), thus the 2/3rds who didn’t take the SAT must have a mean IQ (on the SAT) of 97.
Slope of standardized regression line
As mentioned above, if there were a perfect correlation between IQ and college attended, then Caltechies would have a median IQ of 161 and non-SAT takers would have a mean IQ of 93: A gap of 68 points.
But the actual IQs (as measured by the SAT) are 142 and 97 for Caltechies and non-SAT takers respectively (a gap of 45 points).
In a bivariate normal distribution (which this may not be), the slope of the standardized line of best fit in a scatter plot equals the correlation between X and Y. As you’ll recall from grade 9 math, slope = rise/run. Rise = increase along the Y axis, run = increase along the X axis.
In this case, the increase on the Y axis is estimated at 45 points (the actual IQ gap between Caltechies and non-SAT takers) and the increase on the X axis is 68 points (the theoretical IQ increase if the correlation were perfect). Dividing 45 by 68 gives a slope of 0.66, or roughly 0.7, which is the same correlation as inferred from the analysis of variance performed earlier in this post.
Does correlating college attended with SAT overestimate the correlation between IQ and college attended?
The answer is yes. Because colleges, especially competitive colleges, actively select students based on SATs, said students would regress precipitously to the mean on an IQ test not used to select them. Assuming a 0.72 correlation between the SAT and the Wechsler intelligence scales, I’d expect the correlation between college attended and IQ to drop from 0.7 to 0.7(0.72) = 0.5 if a neutral IQ test were used. Thus, where you went to college is only a very rough proxy for IQ, unless the IQ was measured by the SAT (or similar tests) in-which case it’s a somewhat strong proxy.
https://www.act.org/solutions/college-career-readiness/compare-act-sat/
ACT composite 19 = SAT 910
23.835 + 0.081(910) = 97.545
My IQ is 113
113 – 97.545 = 15.455
15.455(0.5) = 7.7275
97.545 + 7.7275 = 105.2725
105
What is the actual IQ of non-SAT takers? We know that the average SAT score of the 2/3rd of U.S. late teens who take the SAT is about 1016 (IQ 106), and we know the average IQ of all U.S. teens is 100 (by definition), thus the 2/3rds who didn’t take the SAT must have a mean IQ (on the SAT) of 97.
Most of my time spent in 11th and 12th was devoted to my A.I. project. I also edited Wikipedia allot. If I had focused on Math and English my score on the ACT would have been higher. My mom did not care what my grades were. In middle school I would say up till 2 a.m. watching cartoons. I would get up at 7 a.m. to catch the bus. Each year I participated in the science fair so about 3 times. Elementary school was fun. in 5th grade we learned about whale evolution. In 1999 there was a website about Star Wars. That website does not exist anymore. I took one semester of collage in fall 2007. I got stressed out living in the group home so I quit and just live in the group home the next 18 months. All in all it was 24 months. You can only stay 6 months but I guess they made an exception for me. When I got my SSDI I had an apartment. I got a really bad case of OCD alone in my apartment. All I had was the internet for 18 months before I got my job. The movie Howard Hughes played by the actor Leonardo Dicaprio was how I felt all the time for those 18 months alone in my apartment. During that time I copied some java code made by thenewboston YouTube channel. It was only the display part. I made some matrix rain, water ripples, and a cube I found in at a Java example website. I put the water ripples in a jar file, you can open it in a window just like you can open a word document with an icon. Halo is a fun PC game and so is Star Wars Knights of the old republic 2. It was something to do in my apartment. I even joined some online forums. Its not so bad that I gave up on school the last two years of it. I still remember the emotions I had from everything I did. I remember thinking that everything would get better someday. Think is a four letter word. 🙂
I wonder what it would be like to have eidetic memory. That person with an IQ of 170 thought I had it. He figured out how to see in the dark. That is possible I think. chronometry would prove seeing in the dark is possible. He has panic attacks with hallucinations and he likes ICP(insane clown posy). My sister boyfriend has an IQ of 120. They broke up 11 months ago. My other friend who is a raper with 140 IQ helped me understand I was not stupid. I think Eminem the raper is 145. They are not the same person. I think the information subtest on the wais 4 underestimates every thing that I do know. I knew who invested Sherlock Hholmes(Sir Arthur Conan Doyle) but I did not know who wrote Alice in Wonderland. The subtest never asked about Jules Verne, Issac Asimov, Arthur C Clarke, John von Neumann, Alan Turing, John Nash, Marvin Minsky, nor C.S. Lewis. Free Willy was a great movie and The Might Ducks(hockey) and Back to the future. Logan’s Run and Battlestar Galactica(1978 show) made me wonder about ancient earth history. The Hitchhiker guide to the galaxy(1981) was depressing. Invader Zim was cool and Dinosaurs (TV Series 1991–1994). The real adventures of Johnny Quest, Reboot, Power rangers and That’s so weird were fantastic. I know more than the information subtest measure. But it is filled TV stuff and book stuff. I would be different if I was not poor and had parents that cared about school. My head would be filled with Maths and English if that were the case.
This is when I was 12. Fifth grade.
Twelve again.
13 I drew this but I understood what space-time geometry was at age 10.
The little blue thing is a life form made of the same metal as the T-1000 liquid terminator. It has an environment where it can have fun. I drew this at age 11.
There is so much more, I always wanted to be an inventor. I really loved my toys. Bible camp was fun. They actually have rivers and green forests up there. Everyone hates the matrix trilogy, not the first movie but the last two films. I think they have deep meaning in them. I cried when Trinity died. Neo transcended to a high plan of reality. His consciousness dispersed into everyone in the matrix. His spirit now resides in the collective.
Fun TV shows I watched in the 90’s
I find it interesting that you allegedly have a VCI score of 130+ but make elementary spelling errors such as “raper” and “allot”, despite english being your first language.
I’m not sure why people associate spelling with verbal IQ. Yes spelling has to do with words and words are by definition verbal, but it seems to me that spelling has a lot to do with visual memory which is not a verbal ability.
That is embarrassing.
Maybe Pumpkin can change it to rapper?
maybe even gum wrapper 🙂
Particularly in English, spelling is more about visual memory than verbal/aural memory. In German or Spanish, where there’s almost a one-to-one correlation between word sounds and spelling, I’m guessing spelling has more to do with verbal/aural memory.
oral memory?
Quite a number of American born East Asians have problems expressing themselves in English or any other Indo-European language.
))))))))))))))))))))))
Last November I took the new PSAT, and my score report (obtained in early January) contains a feature I think you’ll find extremely intriguing. In addition to the usual math, reading and combined score percentiles, the report also includes a second set of percentiles purporting to show in which percentile a student would score if every US 11th grader took the test. If you’re interested, I may be able to provide you with a screenshot of my scorecard.
If you can that would be great, but don’t go to too much trouble, because there are two limitations to the data:
1) PSAT scores of 11th graders don’t really tell us the distribution of SATs of 17-year-olds, unless there’s some simple conversion for different scale and different age
2) Every 11th grader in the nation still does not include high school dropouts, though these are a small percentage and might be easily adjusted for
Btw your candidate Marco Rubio is taking some heat over his debate performance
Hi, Pumpkin,
I have the pictures, but I need an email address to send them to because I can’t without a wordpress account include images in a comment (not to my knowledge anyhow). The differences in scores between the test-taking sample and the national one are rather smaller than I expected (usually about 9 points), but interesting nonetheless.
As for Rubio – meh. Saturday really killed the Marco-mentum he gained coming out of Iowa. Real shame. A lot depends on today’s New Hampshire results. If he can somehow scrape a second-place finish (which post recent polls would indicate), then he still has a shot at the nomination – fingers crossed.
Your candidate is looking to clean up nicely tonight.
You can email the picture to:
EASIESTQUESTION@HOTMAIL.CA
Thanks
And yes, great night for my candidate
You should do 4 estimates of IQ in particular. Estimates of the men whom I consider to have been the greatest intellects of our time or any time
Jon Von Neumann, Carl Friedrich Gauss, Leonhard Euler and Isaac Newton.
I want to see who, according to your estimation comes out on top.
I will add them to my waiting list but historical figures are trickier.
Pumpkin Person“65% of all American late teens do not take the SAT”
I found my school records that say I took the PSAT/NMSQT. I took my scores and found what should be my IQ from the percentile of the test takers and the non test takers.
I am in the 72 percentile of test takers. (critical reading)
If the number of test takers is 35 (100 – 65)
Then I would be [0.72(35) + 65] = 90.2
90.2 means that if everyone took the test,
I would be in the 90th percentile of students.
This assumes that most people in the bottom 65 percent did not reach above the 72nd percentile. If a relatively large amount of the people in the 65th population scored above the 72nd percentile then I would have a lower percentile.
Here are my calculations.
The IQs I get are lower than Rodrigo La Jara’s reference says- is your formula based on white norms?
Coulter thinks Bosnians are “non-whites”;
https://coulterwatch.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/coulter-still-lying-after-all-these-years/
Of course all Latin Americans except Ted Cruz’s family are non-white, but Bosnians? Really?
Seriously, trolling or low verbal IQ/working memory. An appalling lack of basic knowledge.
I’m really looking forward to your analysis of her IQ….
My second point was that you shouldn’t ‘t spend TOO much time looking into Coulter’s remarks, they are for shock points and many times are blatantly absurd.
Hello,
IQ in top schools is really an interesting topic.
I think that this :
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/finding-the-next-einstein/201410/1339-us-colleges-ranked-average-student-brainpower
Could give another additional approximation.
Sadly, I haven’t found the original study. But just looking at the image, only 10/1336 schools have an average higher than 1450 points.
Maybee this could be an indicator that students from top schools are in the top 1% of students using Lumosity.
It’s probably safe to assume that average Lumosity users have an IQ higher than the average American student who also has an IQ higher than the American general population.
So an average IQ of 140 in top schools seem possible.
Does anyone use Lumosity or have access to the distribution of Lumosity points in the general population?
This is the correct link.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/finding-the-next-einstein/201501/irony-brain-games-don-t-increase-iq-measure-iq